Third Millennium Education
Third Millennium Education

Episode 13 · 1 year ago

Hannah Jones, Founder of Connecting Learning

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Hannah Jones, founder & director of Connecting Learning talks about how technology can benefit education.

Hannah Jones says “Technology needs to make learning easier, quicker, or better.”

“Learners need to get excited about creating content online and collaborating together.”

“It is important to have fun while learning.”

“Technology needs to make learning easier, quicker, or better.”

“Learners should have the option and the ability to use technology as part of their evidence in learning.”

Connect with Hannah Jones on Linkedin 

Third Millennium Education, it is a collection of thoughts and inspirations of stakeholders within education. What is education for and who is it serving?

I'm delighted to be hosting this podcast. Third Millennium Education. It's a collection of thoughts and inspirations of stakeholders within education. What is education for? On who is it serving? This's a podcast exploring state mandated education, its relevance impact and how it can best meet the needs of third millennium learners. Employers on the country. My interview. Exciting people who have had direct experience of education, whether you are a parent, training to be a teacher, a policy maker and academic or an education innovator, nobody working attack. There will be something for you. I'm your host. Centre hopes today. I am delighted to welcome Hannah Jones to the third Millennium Education Punch card. She's the founder of Connecting. Learning on has led national and global, and I see T transformation projects and education. She's crazy, even initiative on educated with a real emphasis on what happens in the classroom. Hannah welcome. They very much. Thank you very much. I'd like to start off with a really open ended question. Tell me a bit about your experience of education. Either is a professional or the user, you know, review Hannah and education. Uh, there's a user. I am. I was very math since team focused. Let's put it that way. I didn't really do any English crosswords inform the school. So I was very much focused on. I would have loved it. A sort of vocational, secondary pro gently. But I had a good education to write, and I enjoyed invitation on then, since during that I was a teacher and all facing schools, including special schools, got the leadership but then went to work with little authorities. Did the literacy numeracy on got involved in technology. I saw interactive whiteboards being used on the news to explain the war, actually, and thought they would be good in education on DH, the national strategies. I wanted to do a project. Charles Clarke was 50 million to expand that project as it was successful. I mean, silly technology, really. Having worked in technology, it became very clear very quickly is all about the ladies shoes of that. I'm planning that to make sure we've got some sustainability and systems in place. So I went tio with the National College, another privilege of working the some of the lady and heads in the country in terms of pushing the technology, gentlemen, forward on supplies as well. Then we have building skills for the future and that I've been looking to work with the likes of learning crowd and Stephen happily, you second guessed on their child in there and some real innovators in terms of really making best use of that design all technology or never...

...approach new timetable new curriculum to actually deepened the learning. Whether the lenses are, however, whether they're in school, I'm Alex privilege. Like now I get to work with some academies interests doing same thing, both here in international ice. It's bright. So take me back to you, watching the news and seeing an interactive white Well, what year was this? Oh, no. Sit back 20 years ago, probably now on the strategies were obviously looking to put technology in schools as well. First of all, we had a 100,000 to a pilot in six local authorities. I'm from Cumbria, Teo Oxford, the Brattle Forest on Do we have the pleasure of working with 10 of the sort of handpick skills and some great consultants because I'm arrived folks on the teaching and learning it went well, but yeah, that was 20 years ago. I'm not certainly attractive White Board should be in schools now. I think the technology has definitely moved on, but what it did do was reduced the fear of technology and just put the touch in front of the hand of teachers and learners. So I think it placed it that a decade after you started that work, I was going around a lot of schools and visiting as I wass in fact, just the other way. And I'm still surprised between the gap between the art of the possible and what is actually happening on DH. Certainly at the early noughties, which is when you were looking at whiteboards, we were also talking about how technology could enable a power ship talent could do you could be a real disruptor. What do you feel have been the great successes of technology in the classroom and what's still yet to come? And then maybe a bit about why I think there's some fantastic work, very normal in many, many academies and across many trust all phases and special. But obviously there are some Academy is where that hasn't been. The focus on that might be well, we know financial the majority of heads budgets do need to go on staff. And actually, you know, I won't want to be in any heads position with budgets at the moment. S Oh, absolutely sympathy there so that it just hasn't been the investment sometimes. But there are some really good examples. I think the successes at the moment are definitely sort of office. 365 Goodwill for education in terms of learning from home and leading anywhere on organising that online learning within schools. Good use of presentation technologies that are a lot of schools and academies now also moving towards a 1 to 1 solution within their schools, particularly secondary schools on There's a lot of good supplier's coming up with solutions to help them do that financially as well. But that of the structure in place so presentation technologies within the classroom, the amount of devices get into the hands of...

...learners and teachers on the you know, the communication told that environment like office 36 5 all Google environment to just make sure that learning is accessible for anybody anyway. You know it completely supports the equity and access agenda in terms again technology into the hands of learners. Well, what do you think? It, I suppose. What? I'm very struck by the technologies that if I look at my own technology, transformation just is a little old May from the early noughties, too. Now, technology, whether it's the Internet, things in my doorbell or my heating system or my ability to know where my parcel is. Um, Tio, how I communicate with my friends every day has really radically changed anything. Education is kept up with that technology opportunity. I can I can hear what you say about money, but I wonder if there's something more. If you feel it's kept up, that's great. If no, if there's something more than just money compared to the rate of other sectors, yes, we've kept open. Actually, in many cases we're pushing forward. You know, schools have done an excellent job in terms of supporting the remote learning. Currently on yesterday ways to reflect on that and we've got a lot of findings that are coming out from that. I mean, I'm looking at the recent peace to serve at the moment January 2021 in terms of what it calls them out, learning I'm 39% of parents didn't think that their Children were engaged in remote learning on that went up to 59% for pupils with any type of special educational needs, your disability. So you know, 40% and 60% saying no, it's not working. Um is quite a high figure, and we need to work on that. But in terms of the sector adopting technology and you're going to get the standard distribution of those that having those that haven't yes, I think we're fairly well up back on guy. Think we've got good models, too, to make it even better. You know, at the moment we're in the data trusts. Going through single talus is just so that everything that you've mentioned from data monitoring to communication is just that much better and that much more some seamless. We've got the egg, take mental strength to schools and colleges, 50 off them that are doing some fantastic work and each of them working with the back 40 or 50 other academies. You know, school's going into 1 to 1 projects and schools is they're building this up and now it is a priority for everybody's is one of the main priorities. You know, we may go back into this that we're looking for solutions to really help them improve land on the solutions right there on DH often on no. As expensive as you would think or as they used to be, these demonstrator cites working with up to 50 school. Pick out some things that really excited you thatyou thing coming...

...out of those I've talked about the one I know the most. Which is Sophie's Hee Park in Walsall with with head teacher Yeah, Sally Lanny on It's my colleague That many works with Dr Diabetes Wyler, but they have been working. Really. They're big, full form entry prime restoring morsel. They've been working Teo improve their use off often 365 communicated till they're smarter protease tools. So that very much looked at the interactive teaching and learning. They're very much leadership on developing talent and capacity within the school focus. I recently they've done a framework like the old S R F support schools, you actually judging where they are in terms of learning from home, so that actually that Khun benchmark themselves so that we can reduce these high figures of learners that aren't engaged, but also look at all aspects from training Teo, safeguarding the safety within those online environments. So now they're tools out there that can be used and adopted by Ladyship James within a condom use across the country on DH. Other demonstrates schools will have two from focuses, so it's definitely worth a look on their Web site to see what's available on what free sport and peer support is available through the programme. I definitely want to come back, Tio, what you're saying about those tools that actually capture the learning of young people and the progress that they're making in their levels of engagement because I think there is a big issue around now. We've, you know, twice. We've said that actually, your your end goal of your exams can be managed differently on I think I've really like to hear your thoughts on what that different might look like. But before we get there, a lot of what you're talking about is really impactful is stuff that I would know from my professional life. It's things that I am using, so I'm running teams meetings, not got. We've all got our white holds up on teams that were interacting, brain storming ideas and think, Where is at one point I was hearing a lot about things like the rolls or mentioned reality we play in teaching and learning and inside Have we gone down a more prosaic but practical and deliverable route? Or are there things that are slightly more out there that practise aren't in our everyday lives that are happening in education? That might end up being a bit of us of a driver for a revolution? Yeah, I think they're both on. And I think that the trick is having that, um, whatever is best purposeful from her for that teach nor learning. So at the moment, I'm working a lot with vocational education and the tech sector. A look for you if I actually hear they do some excellent projects and from...

...some excellent projects for those that are looking to use technology to support vocational learning, I'll give you the link for their work. Some really, truly excellent one. But at the moment we're working a lot in the care sector on using the R, and they are to actually support the leadership, the structures to bring the sort of S m A care providers under a sort of technology roof, but also advice there. I'm obviously the benefits that they are. They are. They have in terms of remote training, on assessment in terms of lifting and handling in terms of Villa puncture and actually delivering that process safely. You know, we've got haptic holograms the dentist now use in terms of half a cadaver for their training's on DH. That's like actually touching the teeth on the incest spend on. The accuracy improves, you know, changing it a stain on a patient. No patient will want you to practise that on them 20 times, but actually we can use technology successfully on in a real life situation as possible, whether that be in a large care home or in somebody's living room. We can change those environments. So actually that the i r. In the deal, in my opinion, on in those that were working with hugely help in terms of the trailing, the preparation, getting those people into that sector, so actually said that they can see it safely. You know, technology is a great environment. Sea environments safely on to practise those environments, so the summit Really exciting work going on there. There is another project where a Hamlet she scorned seeks on that one. So I want you to write that one. But that will be hugely exciting for education. Andi Esteem Surely going through, I'll give you an update of bitters. I confide. Definitely want an update on that. So what I'm hearing about things like they are in a R is that actually, they could have a really transformational role, particularly vocational learning and practical learning. Andan I saw in augmented reality demonstration off the human body some 15 years ago Where this non existent creature a hologram. Something popped up in a classroom. I mean, we were all on the edge of our seats. I mean, I was there with the students. This is wicked, but obviously there was a long way to go to making it a useful learn until that at that point, it was just like, Wow, we're really having a good time here. So I assume that you can tell us about applications in education. I'd be really interested. But before we move on, and I just wanted to be a bit of a pusher on this technology. There have been a lot of planes about the role of artificial intelligence in learning, particularly an assessment in feedback in exam...

...preparation. And there are companies that I, you know I'm gonna mention, because I know that if they could buy the re different, but who really set their stall out on using Ay tio drive learning for young people on, I wonder where you've seen great examples where you've got some questions. Whether you think that is, it's somewhere where we will go where actually teachers won't be assessing. Your learning machine will guided and facilitated by the teacher at all times because we have to decide what we're assessing on DH. Why and hopefully the sort of national assessment structures will also move towards more reversal of technology based approach as well, eh, so that we can do that seamlessly. I think I will have and can have a huge benefit in terms of learning that I mean, I CT can do three things it can represent. Information on that information can be easily changed into multiple forms to represent it to various uses. It can be used to collect and analyse that information and also eat provides instant feedback. Where is no teacher? Although I've seen some excellent examples when I've been helping my niece, let's say help him when they still have my turn work of how teachers get interacted it it can provide instant feedback now the average feedback loop in secondary schools, at least when I looked into this sort of 15 years ago, so I'm not saying nah, booze was, on average, two weeks. Where is technology is instant and I I can only help support. That is, all it will do is analyse strength sweetens is directed to eat except et cetera. I must admit I haven't seen specific examples in schools. I'll not be interested to see them. I really got bad examples of every time I give or something. Facebook lets me know that I can have 20,000 of them. So again, I think what is important and it's the time to do it now. As ever before, we really see an incessant this pushed by suppliers that heads get involved, lead that way as to what will be useful in terms of that process. But I'll be interested to hear about that one. Haven't got specifics for you. But I'm done That Will will. By the end of the way I saw looked like Thanks. Thanks for picking that one example of Zen of us fight. But what ideo I like keeping an eye on their toes. No, I mean it is It is interesting to me because the loss of the technology businesses that have set up talking about Aye aye learning assessment. They are very content driven on stuff before I come to assessment because it is so not forgot because I'm obsessed with it on this this tension in our lives at the moment between the impart and therefore an education between the acquisition of content, Andi, skill development and...

...skills learning. So I've interviewed quite a few people on the podcast so far, and the employers are often saying what I'm actually looking for is somebody who conduced, demonstrate creativity or critical thinking or knows how to work as a team. And so they're looking for skills. And who were you with the assessment? And yet what we're measuring is content acquisition in the main. Not always. And I wonder what role you feel that the technology that you're working within schools are actually enabling a more rounded approach to that whole skill development pieces opposed to content about them yet definitely. I mean, there's a set when you asked her the one of the city's key things. At the moment, it's those environments that aren't content but their infrastructures to enable. Yes, the loading, on reviewing of content, but also the discussions, the collaborations, the different channels, the projects. The one note you know that they really put the tools in the hands of the learners and the teachers to do that successfully and to have a successful online environment. I think you have tohave the training on DH, the time ball teachers on learners. To develop those structures on, you have to have the technical support to make sure that May is a mass departments. I want to run it this way. I want these people took this permissions. I want to do these type of activities. I have a technical person that consistent my office 365 environment for me to do that so I can focus on the teaching and the learning. They're having the most impact and learning on there. The absolute tools to do the skills development. You will need some content in there. I've just mentioned care, You know, they're absolutely some media content, some discussions that we need in the But we've got the tools to do the job. We just need the training, the time, the examples on DH, the templates to put those environments in in quickly. And I mean, that's really encouraging because a few years ago I was working on a project which wass looking at I won't say which. I'm sure you all know. I was looking at how you really deliver an entire creek and through project by slamming very, very focused on science and technology on DTH e effort in then mak ng back to the content correctly, which you had to do was quite made one tiny head hurt, but half the time, the only way to deliver that wass around a big table with lots of bits of paper on. So hearing you saying how we can use tools like Google Classroom or 365 So actually do that remotely. Does that benefit the way we think the school day will be structured and he can he can affect the way the school days structured, I mean again, they've recently I saw in the press the other day the five term curricular.

We've also had staggered start times with teenagers started slightly later in terms of the researchers to win their breaks and more active as well. So we've had staggered start times. We've had five term years, you know, the three term wass agricultural in terms of the times that we did. But but I think there's lots of factors to consider on an individual basis there, you know, you communities on DH that you're working with the networks for them so into in terms consultation. But it definitely opens up to the point of how many hours do learn is need to patch to be in school on that, with the growth that we've got in many local authorities and areas, Andi, in terms of the amount of school bills and extensions that we need, would also help address that problem for many a cz Well, but we need models of whether that's going to work. And I'm understood all those models will start tonight. Well, we certainly all had unexpected evidence based drawing with, um and, you know, trying to look on. This ghastly thing is, you know, in any kind of positivity. So what do you think about the balance? We currently have a contact lens curriculum on DH developmental and skills based curriculum. What way would you push it if you have the magic worlds? If I have the magic one that cushy a lot further, too. Skills based. But it's quality content. I see a lot of content that that's not quality. I was helping my niece with her. My son work. Andi used no more environment right now in its foot. I rolled my eyeballs. To begin with is a must petition. I'm actually brilliant. When when I needed refraction, I kicked on the help and it took me to the exact spot in that video. I could do a test question. I'll help mine Easter test question at me one that way. So it's brilliant. On another night I did actually Mewtwo teacher because I was seven minutes into the lesson on DIT was watching, hinted in a worksheet which again that master stand to to try and me. But I wasn't engaged in that learning at all, and I was put off learning at that specific point. The teacher also provided mass contents. I'm not being too critical, but there's good and bags on. We've had to do this, that spade, and they need to know, reflect on that and do to speed. But I'd like content creators with our learners, not content consumers. You know, we're so used to scrawl in on screens as shoppers or snap shutters or whatever they do these days that actually we need to get learn, is excited about creating content online, about creating their own websites and their own naps and collaborating together and having the funny alone. In...

...that way on DH. I'm very mindful that we don't put Children off technology as well, because we're having to increase this free time for them. Actually, we having to increase the screen time for them. But, you know, I would love to give my nephew a project that means he plays off from the screen for four hours and just comes back to show me what he's doing. He doesn't need to be physically sitting down with that screen for those four hours, but again that needs time to develop. That content is you. You said that project based learning, mapping that back to make sure that we have covered the curriculum areas. But make sure that we can still do the assessment that is content based, you know, as a teacher in Year six if I'd given them enough, so they're going to get a good level falls on Level five, Little said that we're going to enjoy the learning that we do. So you know, we'd also need two addresses. You keep mentioning the assessment area too much the curriculum. We do need some content and we didn't do any good content. And I think that the content, I completely agree and I think we love content created. And I think the more we can do that, the more we're promoting general literally, but also digital literacy amongst the young people because they're using in a way that is genuinely engaging. And I think there's no doubt that we need some, you know, some fundamental content. But actually, if we don't embrace what's out there on their ability to access content and information and actually put it in their hands when I was involved in flipped learning projects for 78 years ago, where you know, the young people being that was their role, and some of them were normal. What the young people presented in the shared learning was amazing. And some of them was the laziest teaching I've ever seen in my life. Ah, no. I think that whatever you're putting in place, you need to make sure Exactly as you said. There's properly understood and people properly behind it. And it is properly resourced and trained for Yeah, And again, that goes back to the leadership on DH two somewhat. The infrastructures that were in place for to trust this week we do in single tendency on that means that they can Yes, of all the individual turns is at the moment. But again, you can get issues. Then you just want to make your scene. This was possible. So any good practise that is happening. And resources, any content paid their learning could be shed easily across those trust on the leadership can can monitor that Ethan support back through software across that single tendencias. Well, so again, it's using technology to get out of it. What you want that collaboration that reviewing had learning that planning the next steps technology needs to make it easier, quicker or better. Otherwise, people weren't too doctor, and it's got to the point now that it is simple. But it is simple, and there are solutions there that will do what schools want to...

...do from single tendency to a R V r. They've been done in education in this country, you know, there are places we can go say their providers, that Khun Support is doing it, so it's a very exciting time. One schools are on that sort of digital journey. At the beginning, we have got because of the digital gap. A lot of schools to get in on The first stage is onto that journey at the moment, in terms again, their infrastructure they brought about their wife are salty diets and devices into the hands of learners when they haven't had them before. So we just need to support people at those various stages. There's another toll, for example, is what is the online learning. I mentioned that easy parking developed this edgy think of just in a sort of process to support schools in terms of 1 to 1 projects and what they need to think about from home access to save guardian to lease in verses. Licencing exception except et cetera. So there are lots of tools on lots of examples coming out populist. I am going to take you onto that question of assessment on At the moment, we have traditionally done assessment based on trying to capture the amount of content predominantly, that's our learners have managed to acquire and retained for the period of the exam. There's been lots of controversy about, you know, teacher let assessments. What part do you think technology can play in changing what we do now on DH, allowing maybe more innovative ways of showing a young person's development capabilities For a start, Learners should have the option and ability to use technology to us part of their evidence in learning their Cem Brilliant creative digital content creators out there and I want to see their videos and I want to see their games and their websites and their storyboards on technology gives me the ability to follow that journey with them or review that journey at the end through very portfolio and their resources on there. So whether they can answer a question or not might not be what is evident, good learning within that curriculum area, so it can obviously be used as a tool of some way Palin pencil thin. But it should be used, you know, in terms of a learner, should have access to it. Full stop, in my opinion, for that on obviously, tests can be available on administrative online and obviously the market of that. I'm a mathematician, complete them online for some of it as a mathematician as well. I don't want everything skills based. I don't actually like content assessments, and I think we need to accept that some students do. That's what they like. So I wouldn't have wanted a lot of project...

...based learning because it wasn't the way I did. He Andi wasn't the way I evidence Tower did it. But if I did, I want all the I's duty tools available to remain all my editing tools, and I want to be able to demonstrate it the way that I could have done a picture in oils or past ALS. I want to be able to use a PlayStation platform to celebrate my drama. For one thing, do you think that the era of the GCM yet GCS and a levels just looking at the at the English correct living more the UK Do you think that here is over? Do you think we need to put it to bed now and come up with something different and we need you to put it to better back 20 years ago. But it's been the hardest thing to move in education at least that I've seen since I've been working education for the last 2030 years. Um, I hope so, but it never seems to get into base. Never seems tohave the focus or understanding the government level that that it needs. And hopefully they'll involve. I had teachers, a married teacher, unions in getting some better assessment models in place. Well, you you would hide. I completely agree with you. I think it is time for its going to bed. Well, I think there are very many more ways we can do this. That one only help young people, but will, you're coming at it from a purely commercial point of view. Will help me as an employer with well, exactly on time and again the sector on that. I'm working with a lot of Obamacare. That's exactly what they're facing at the moment. You know, we are looking at recruitment, trying to get younger people into beasts and through that using technology to do it. But then when those people apply, we want to be able to see an evidence the fact that they are able to do the job successfully and competently. Now, at the moment, most care providers will retrain because they need Teo. Assure CQ seethe same Listen, school's offset. So they need to pass off state but also seek, you see on. Because of that, you've got massive training on also people being retrained within six months, whereas actually technology can provided benchmark for that on an environment for that on a place where employers can go to see what what these learners condemned. If I am employing on I'm in a tech company, I don't want to see at least of a, you know, sevens, eights, nines. I want to see what that line is done. Yeah, and actually that evidence based on have we can help young people captured their skills and their evidence differently throughout their lives on DH, I mean, I think that that has a real opportunity to level the playing field, particularly around your people, from very disadvantage. You know, actually, poor backgrounds, because often their skill acquisition is incredible. We just don't give them any tools to help identify the skills that they captured on your mark. It is double a CZ. Well, if you ask...

...specialist enough in that area Absolutely. Hello. It's been a complete pleasure. Thank you very much for your time. I'm forward to catching back up with you on those two things you're gonna look into on DH. I will run the web link alongside your Thank you very much for your time. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you for listening to this episode of Third Millennium Education. I'd like to know what has been your biggest takeaway from this conversation. If you did enjoy this episode, do hit the subscribe button to continue to receive future episodes of this. If you would like to be interviewed or you know somebody who would be good to interview, please also get in touch. I hope you'll join me on the next episode. And together we can carry on the conversation to ensure that we can best meet the needs of Third Millennium Learners employers in the country. Thank you again and see you on the next episode.

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